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  #1591  
Old 07-25-2013, 12:25 PM
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Originally Posted by 300%_Density View Post
So a year ago I downloaded all '96 Nitro torrents & ppvs and watched in order. Maybe a small part of this has to do w/ knowing what happens already. Im a couple Nitros after nWo started. W/ everything leading up to Bash At The Beach, how did people not suspect Hogan was the 3rd man?

Obviously this is in the infancy of internet & dirt reports and all that stuff. But I started realizing, Hogan hadn't been on tv for how many months leading up to that ppv? Maybe its partial revisionist history but if you watched WCW weekly isn't that something that could have been predicted?
I think the reason Hogan was such a shock as the third man in the NWO is because a turn that massive had never happened before in wrestling. Sure, good guys turned bad before and vice versa but Hogan was THE good guy. He was the man that all the people looked up to for so many years, the guy that was the face of all that was good and right in the world of wrestling. Hogan ever playing a bad guy was just something unthinkable at the time. Even Hogan has said since then he was very hesitant to do it because of what his character stood for. But he and Bischoff agreed that the story needed something shocking to take it to the next level so he went through with it.

I remember my brother and I watching Bash At The Beach 96 live and neither of us thought about Hogan being the third man leading up to it. I kind of called it at the last minute when Hogan was coming down to the ring and Heenan said "but which side is he on?" Once Hogan hit the ring I said "he's gonna attack Savage" and then ten seconds later he did. Still, a huge shock when it did happen. Even though Savage is one of my all time favorites, I got into wrestling in the 80s because of Hogan and was a big fan of Hall and Nash from their WWF run so I really liked when it happened.

I don't remember the dirt sheets too well from that time so somebody may have predicted that was gonna happen and i'm sure everyone just laughed it off. But overall WCW did a damn good job with making sure nothing about the early stages of the NWO story were leaked online. It still wasn't even clear for awhile weather or not Hall and Nash were still under WWF contract and if Bischoff and Vince weren't working together for some super angle involving both companies.
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  #1592  
Old 07-25-2013, 12:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 300%_Density View Post
So a year ago I downloaded all '96 Nitro torrents & ppvs and watched in order. Maybe a small part of this has to do w/ knowing what happens already. Im a couple Nitros after nWo started. W/ everything leading up to Bash At The Beach, how did people not suspect Hogan was the 3rd man?

Obviously this is in the infancy of internet & dirt reports and all that stuff. But I started realizing, Hogan hadn't been on tv for how many months leading up to that ppv? Maybe its partial revisionist history but if you watched WCW weekly isn't that something that could have been predicted?
I think it was also a shock because it was only the mid 90's. Today we have seen every possible heel/face turn, almost every impact of a storyline, nothing these days is much of a surprise. Back then "OMG OMG OMG SO AND SO IS BLAH BLAH BLAH" was happening almost every week. That is another reason why wrestling is so stale these days. It can be enjoyable, like we have briefly discussed, there isn't much surprise anymore. Even if Cena turned heel, big whoop, I don't see it being that big, unless you're 6.
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  #1593  
Old 07-25-2013, 12:49 PM
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Nah, Cena turning heel would be a shock if it happened now if for no other reason than the WWE has been so firmly against doing it for years now. Half the crowd should not be booing you're face of the company, it's not good business. They had the perfect opportunity to do it to last week on RAW when he named Daniel Bryan as his opponent for SummerSlam. Bryan is so insanely over right now it's ridiculous and once Bryan was done celebrating in the corner, the moment he turned around Cena should've nailed him with the belt and made the turn. A major opportunity lost right there.

Also, what happened to when two or three guys used to swap a championship back and forth for like six months or a year? That really made the rivalries more intense back then. I don't mind guys having long title runs to establish the belt and the person as a legit champ. But a feud where a championship is flipped back and forth a few times for a bit can be interesting and something they should think about doing again especially if they want a rivalry to have some excitement to it.
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  #1594  
Old 07-25-2013, 01:17 PM
300%_Density 300%_Density is offline
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Yea I guess those are good points. Obviously yes it was a complete shock to pretty much anybody that saw it happen. So both of those points I do get. It was absolutely unfathomable to think of him not as a good guy.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but weren't people kind of booing him a little bit throughout '96 before Bash? It seemed like there was a small amount of people that kinda started booing a little bit before he took the time off before Bash. I will admit that WCW (about the only huge thing they did the right way) absolutely did the right thing in setting up Hogan to be the 3rd man. Thank god for the mid 90's because there's NO WAY something of that magnitude could have happened in 2013.

I'm still a little baffled that more people didn't have atleast an idea that could happen, it seemed like the Hulkster gimmick was starting to wear on atleast a few WCW fans in the first part of '96. Not saying I would have expected it either, but after watching all those Nitros now its like a light bulb just came on. Either way I'm having a blast going through all of these a little bit at a time.
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  #1595  
Old 07-25-2013, 01:56 PM
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The WCW fans were booing Hogan a bit since he went there in 1994. WCW had a different style and fan base and Hogan never really got over with them like he did in the WWF where it has always been more entertainment based as opposed to WCW which was a more wrestling based product.

Hogan's act was growing stale with the WWF audience as well. Before he left in 1993 he certainly wasn't getting the reactions he used to. Also, the fans really got pissed at him after what happened at WrestleMania 9 when after Yokozuna beat Bret Hart for the title, he came out at the end and beat Yoko for the belt in an impromptu match that made no sense. It was no longer Hogan's time and he didn't need the belt. The WWF was starting to build around Bret Hart as the top guy and Yokozuna as an unstoppable monster, so Hogan winning there shouldn't have happened and that's really where fans started to sour on the Hulkster. Fans were even turning on Hogan a bit in 1991 when he feuded with The Undertaker but WrestleMania 9 was when people really started to turn on him. Also, by 1993 the kids that had loved Hogan in the 80s were now growing up and liked different things in wrestling.

We should talk history more often in this thread. It's definitely better than what's going on in wrestling now.
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  #1596  
Old 07-25-2013, 04:58 PM
300%_Density 300%_Density is offline
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Originally Posted by Sanitarium78 View Post
The WCW fans were booing Hogan a bit since he went there in 1994. WCW had a different style and fan base and Hogan never really got over with them like he did in the WWF where it has always been more entertainment based as opposed to WCW which was a more wrestling based product.

Hogan's act was growing stale with the WWF audience as well. Before he left in 1993 he certainly wasn't getting the reactions he used to. Also, the fans really got pissed at him after what happened at WrestleMania 9 when after Yokozuna beat Bret Hart for the title, he came out at the end and beat Yoko for the belt in an impromptu match that made no sense. It was no longer Hogan's time and he didn't need the belt. The WWF was starting to build around Bret Hart as the top guy and Yokozuna as an unstoppable monster, so Hogan winning there shouldn't have happened and that's really where fans started to sour on the Hulkster. Fans were even turning on Hogan a bit in 1991 when he feuded with The Undertaker but WrestleMania 9 was when people really started to turn on him. Also, by 1993 the kids that had loved Hogan in the 80s were now growing up and liked different things in wrestling.

We should talk history more often in this thread. It's definitely better than what's going on in wrestling now.
Couldn't agree more. I don't do wrestling anymore but I'll always watch old stuff.

That's true about Hogan. I forgot about his WWF tenure towards the end. Didn't go over great. Imo I don't think he was completely over w/ WCW (outside of what you said) b/c of the fact his gimmick was dated by '94. Only so far you can take that gimmick as wrestling fans got smarter.

Since I fully support older wrestling, maybe occasionally I might do a tiny review for whatever Nitro/Raw/PPV I watch.
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  #1597  
Old 07-26-2013, 04:38 PM
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Since we're going to talk about older wrestling; I found this posted on another forum and thought I should share it. It's a collection of pictures Stacy Carter (aka the Cat, Jerry Lawlers ex-wife) took backstage at WWF events in (I assume) early 2000. It really takes me back and made me long for those days. Even though I never knew any of these people I got a little emotional looking at them. And there are some fucking funny ones too. All I have to say is "Dean Malenko" and you'll know exactly what picture I'm talking about when you get to it. And "down Lita's shirt"

Part 1

Part 2
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  #1598  
Old 07-26-2013, 04:41 PM
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I think a "shocking" heel turn the WWE totally missed the boat on would've been Goldberg. It wouldn't have been nearly as shocking but it would've had one hell of an impact.

It was even a similar situation; WWE fans never warmed up to Goldberg just like WCW fans never warmed up to Hogan (at least never to the levels in their previous promotions), they were both coming out to mixed reactions. Hogans changed wrestling forever (it was a precursor to the Attitude era), who knows what a Goldberg heel turn could've done in the WWE.

I always wondered; when Hogans doing his speech after the turn that big fat guy tries to get into the ring only to get his ass kicked by Hall a few times before he can get there. What the hell do you think was going through that guys mind? It's one thing to rush a ring when there's a match going on and the wrestlers don't even notice you. But how stupid can you be to rush the ring when two of the three guys are just standing there? And on top of it they're three fucking huge guys?

And as trashy as some people think it was; I LOVE the garbage flying around. That was real rage from the crowd. Maybe the fat guy was going to clean it up and it just worked totally different then he intended.
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  #1599  
Old 07-26-2013, 05:20 PM
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I always thought that fans throwing garbage into the ring was a nice visual and really added to Hogan's turn. Now after that it happened many times when the NWO was in the ring giving a beat down to someone but those people may have been just doing it for fun. The night Hogan turned all that garbage getting thrown in the ring was because people were legit pissed at him.

I always figured the fat dude who rushed into the ring was one of those fans who took wrestling way too seriously and thought the shit was real. I always thought it was a diehard Hulkamaniac who just watched his hero turn to the dark side and wanted a piece of Hogan for turning his back on him. Yes, there are a lot of wrestling fans who are like that.

Still, as a fan you do not jump the rail and get into the ring during a wrestling show. Even if Bubba Ray Dudley is provoking you and trying to pick a fight with you It's an unwritten law in pro wrestling and the wrestlers have every right to attack a fan who does that. It's a self defense thing for the wrestlers since you don't know what that fan has in mind.

This was always my favorite fan run in. It's truly a "what the fuck just happened?" moment.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOhKVCDqrME

At least it looks like Eddie got a good right hand in on that idiot.
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  #1600  
Old 07-26-2013, 05:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sanitarium78 View Post
I always thought that fans throwing garbage into the ring was a nice visual and really added to Hogan's turn. Now after that it happened many times when the NWO was in the ring giving a beat down to someone but those people may have been just doing it for fun. The night Hogan turned all that garbage getting thrown in the ring was because people were legit pissed at him.

I always figured the fat dude who rushed into the ring was one of those fans who took wrestling way too seriously and thought the shit was real. I always thought it was a diehard Hulkamaniac who just watched his hero turn to the dark side and wanted a piece of Hogan for turning his back on him. Yes, there are a lot of wrestling fans who are like that.

Still, as a fan you do not jump the rail and get into the ring during a wrestling show. Even if Bubba Ray Dudley is provoking you and trying to pick a fight with you It's an unwritten law in pro wrestling and the wrestlers have every right to attack a fan who does that. It's a self defense thing for the wrestlers since you don't know what that fan has in mind.

This was always my favorite fan run in. It's truly a "what the fuck just happened?" moment.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NOhKVCDqrME

At least it looks like Eddie got a good right hand in on that idiot.
That Eddie Guerrero/RVD match was a phenominal match. The guy running in and Eddie punching him just adds to its awesomeness.
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