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  #101  
Old 08-03-2011, 08:34 PM
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Originally Posted by idrinkwine732 View Post
It's very easy to commend Arghoslent for maintaining their steadfast ideology, despite that ideology being different from mine or yours, in the face of being successful. I don't see how acknowledgment of fortitude is only okay when the one with fortitude isn't a racist, bigot, etc. We do it in American history all the time.
Well, again, I question whether fortitude for fortitude's sake is such an admirable quality. The Catholic Church really stuck to their guns for centuries on the whole Galileo-and-Copernicus-were-wrong-the-earth-is-the-center-of-the-cosmos thing. Does that make them heroes? Sometimes wrong is just wrong. Sometimes dumb is just dumb. And sticking to it regardless of what everyone says doesn't make you strong or admirable, it just makes you more wrong and more dumb.
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  #102  
Old 08-03-2011, 08:36 PM
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As for MeloDeath, I'm no expert but I like In Flames and Dark Tranquility and think maybe it's time I checked out some Carcass and At the Gates.
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  #103  
Old 08-03-2011, 09:19 PM
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HOW...DARE...YOU....

I really like that nick name. I think I'll start using it.

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Originally Posted by zgodt View Post
Sometimes wrong is just wrong. Sometimes dumb is just dumb. And sticking to it regardless of what everyone says doesn't make you strong or admirable, it just makes you more wrong and more dumb.
You couldn't have made it more obvious that my attempted explanation of perspectives existing besides yours went in one ear and out the other.
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  #104  
Old 08-03-2011, 10:40 PM
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Originally Posted by illuminatus917 View Post
You couldn't have made it more obvious that my attempted explanation of perspectives existing besides yours went in one ear and out the other.
"Perspectives existing besides [mine]" is something I acknowledge and welcome. That's not at all what you were "explaining".

You were arguing an absolute moral relativism: that no truth or perspective is any more valid than any other. It's not that I didn't hear you. It's that I've heard the same argument countless times before. And that I reject it as intellectually and ethically lazy. I can grant that there's no one absolute claim on truth -- no "center" as Nietzsche would have it. It doesn't follow that we can't use observation, conscience, and reason to determine that some truths are better than others, and some "perspectives" are flat-out wrong and dumb.
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  #105  
Old 08-04-2011, 12:09 AM
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Originally Posted by zgodt View Post
no truth or perspective is any more valid than any other
If you look back at what I wrote, I don't think that's what you'll find. I said "no idea, no paradigm, no belief, no anything can be taken as definitively true," which is correct. That's very different than saying "any idea, any paradigm, any belief, any anything is just as valid as any other idea or any belief or any paradigm, etc." Though I actually do believe it pertains to morality (no one set of morals is any more valid than one other set of morals), but that's strictly because of the falseness of archetypal morality, which happens to be the subject in question here I believe.

Absolute relativism and perspectivism are separate branches of philosophy, but they are similar I suppose. Most importantly, perspectivism, though it implies that there can't be any absolute knowledge of anything (epistemological noumonon), whatever it may be, it does not suggest that every single view is as valid as every single other view.

For example, an absolute relativist might say:

"my grass turns purple when I pee on it."

And if we accepted absolute relativism, we would regard that as 100% true because to an absolute relativist the truth is what you choose it to be, simply because of its relevance in your mind. Under strict Nietzschean perspectivism, usually several legitimate perspectives are possible, thus the interpretation of truths. But if we start discussing "what is legitimate," we're just going to reach platitudes; I find it for the most part equivocal. Rather, as far as Nietzsche is concerned, we can never be sure that we are absolutely right. If we are convinced we're absolutely right, we are much more likely to be absolutely wrong. That's the beauty of this philosophy to me, which is why I find it irritating when folks talk in definitive correctness.
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  #106  
Old 08-04-2011, 04:09 AM
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...we can never be sure that we are absolutely right. If we are convinced we're absolutely right, we are much more likely to be absolutely wrong.
On this we can agree.
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  #107  
Old 08-04-2011, 06:14 AM
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Holy shit, I can't wait to take a philosophy class at college
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  #108  
Old 08-04-2011, 06:32 AM
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...
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COME FORTH YOU SHAMELESS DARK CUNT
APPEAL TO MY MERCY FOR YOUR LIFE
I COMMAND THE HELPLESS DAME
BOUND AND SHACKLED IN CHAINS
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  #109  
Old 08-04-2011, 06:46 AM
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Originally Posted by illuminatus917 View Post
my grass turns purple when I pee on it
Then stop peeing on your lawn, you dolt.

Oh, and what the fuck have you been eating?
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  #110  
Old 08-04-2011, 07:07 AM
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Would you consider Edge of Sanity melo-death?
Absolutely. As I would consider Crimson and Crimson II the greatest melodeath albums I've ever heard.
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