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  #11  
Old 03-20-2009, 12:51 PM
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I REMEMBER NOW
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  #12  
Old 03-20-2009, 04:33 PM
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No, but I'm not the only one that thinks American Soldier is a strong cut. I've been following a lot of opinions since the album leaked, and a lot of the folks that have written off the 'Ryche, and did not enjoy O:M II have been surprised, pleasantly, by American Soldier.

I don't understand how Queensryche is an embarrassment. I don't want to read into your perspective, but I assume you would prefer Rage For Order or Mindcrime over Promised Land or Tribe any day.

The band's stylistic shifts do not mean it is an embarrassment to itself. If it's embarrassing to write thoughtful compelling music and not be constrained by genre, then yeah, they're an embarrassment, and some day, I hope I'm an embarrassment to myself as well.

Otherwise, what's an embarrassment? The performances are strong. Wilton is shredding, and this is Eddie's hands-down best overall bass performance on an album. And it's well mixed. The weakest point is Geoff, and while there are some seriously rough spots, overall, and on tracks I highlighted like "Unafraid" or "At 30,000 Ft." or even "Middle of Hell" he does the job, and he does it fine.

That's about all I have to say, but I, I'll go on. If Wilton is "shredding" on this album, that word has clearly been redefined. My first thought when I listened to this is that Geoff Tate just can't sing anymore, he just sounds bad. I respect the fact that he's not trying to sound like he used to, but I just think he sounds weak and whiny most of the time now. This album actually has rapping on it. I had to hold back my vomit at the awful rap/metal-esque garbage on the opening track.
Queensryche attracts the most fanboys of any band I've ever seen. There are many other bands who can evolve and keep a fanbase. Queensryche basically just has a split between those who like the stuff through Promised Land, and those that defend everything they do from a point of 'artist integrity". Not every bad move a band makes was a stroke of artistic individualism, sometimes they just make bad decisions. Not every Queensryche album since Promised Land is void of merit, but this album is no different than most of them to me. I think the band is trying to hide behind a concept that is weak at best. "OMG WAR IS BAD AND IT SUCKS TO BE A SOLDIER!". Yeah, it does, you don't need to write an album about it. Basically this just comes off as crappy, and totally unmemorable. I listened to the whole album once. I can't remember anything I liked about it, hence why I'm saying it sucks, end of story.
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  #13  
Old 03-20-2009, 04:54 PM
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Originally Posted by Maiden33 View Post

That's about all I have to say, but I, I'll go on. If Wilton is "shredding" on this album, that word has clearly been redefined. My first thought when I listened to this is that Geoff Tate just can't sing anymore, he just sounds bad. I respect the fact that he's not trying to sound like he used to, but I just think he sounds weak and whiny most of the time now. This album actually has rapping on it. I had to hold back my vomit at the awful rap/metal-esque garbage on the opening track.
Queensryche attracts the most fanboys of any band I've ever seen. There are many other bands who can evolve and keep a fanbase. Queensryche basically just has a split between those who like the stuff through Promised Land, and those that defend everything they do from a point of 'artist integrity". Not every bad move a band makes was a stroke of artistic individualism, sometimes they just make bad decisions. Not every Queensryche album since Promised Land is void of merit, but this album is no different than most of them to me. I think the band is trying to hide behind a concept that is weak at best. "OMG WAR IS BAD AND IT SUCKS TO BE A SOLDIER!". Yeah, it does, you don't need to write an album about it. Basically this just comes off as crappy, and totally unmemorable. I listened to the whole album once. I can't remember anything I liked about it, hence why I'm saying it sucks, end of story.
That's not rapping. It's a cadence from an actual drill sergeant.

I like how weasly your comments are too. You define something as "rap metal-esque" and suffix "garbage" on to it. If you feel everything rap metal-esque is garbage, than your biases make you no worse than a fanboy because you're judging a label (the fanboys are judging the brand) and not the actual content. What makes it what you call it?

> "Sliver" has a traditional song structure. Verses/choruses/bridges/solo, etc.
> It has your typical hard rock style drumming, with an active bass line.
> It has singing.
> It has electric guitar (hmm, so far it smells like it has a lot of the components of regular ol' rock)
> If you still want to disagree about what I said about the drill sergant, I can assure you it's not rap on the simple ground that... There's not enough there for rap. Don't you usually have at least three consecutive lines of words in rap? Because the sergeant never has more than two ("Welcome to the show"/"Gonna tell you what's up".) - And in military training they refer to battle as "the show" - and this dude is a drill instructor.

So what you're really telling me is that the presence of an actual drill instructor on a song about bootcamp singing two lines is enough for you to pigeon hole the song in an entire sub-genre of two other genres that you happen to consider garbage, yet you still have the audacity to subtly hint that anyone that disagrees with you is probably just defending shitty music under the guise of artistic integrity because they're a non-objective fan boy. If there's not something vaguely hypocritical about all that, then I really don't know what to say.

And if that message about soldiers is what you took away from the album then I don't think you were actually paying that much attention to it.

I don't understand your point about fanboys - still. It's seems obvious that as simply a matter of scale, there are bands with far larger groups of fanboys then Queensryche, because there are bands with far larger audiences. Iron Maiden is the obvious example that comes to mind.

I'm not defending bad songs under the cover of artistic integrity, but you came in here not willing to back up your opinions until you were called on it, and in the interim I merely suggested (and said it might not be the case) that perhaps you were one of the admittedly many people out there that do write off present day QR based on their shift in artistic direction.
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  #14  
Old 03-20-2009, 05:01 PM
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Originally Posted by EvilCheese View Post
That's not rapping. It's a cadence from an actual drill sergeant.

I like how weasly your comments are too. You define something as "rap metal-esque" and suffix "garbage" on to it. If you feel everything rap metal-esque is garbage, than your biases make you no worse than a fanboy because you're judging a label (the fanboys are judging the brand) and not the actual content. What makes it what you call it?

> "Sliver" has a traditional song structure. Verses/choruses/bridges/solo, etc.
> It has your typical hard rock style drumming, with an active bass line.
> It has singing.
> It has electric guitar (hmm, so far it smells like it has a lot of the components of regular ol' rock)
> If you still want to disagree about what I said about the drill sergant, I can assure you it's not rap on the simple ground that... There's not enough there for rap. Don't you usually have at least three consecutive lines of words in rap? Because the sergeant never has more than two ("Welcome to the show"/"Gonna tell you what's up".) - And in military training they refer to battle as "the show" - and this dude is a drill instructor.

So the presence of an actual drill instructor on a song about bootcamp singing two lines is enough for you to pigeon hole the song in an entire sub-genre of two other genres?

And if that message about soldiers is what you took away from the album then I don't think were actually paying that much attention to it.

I don't understand your point about fanboys. It's seems obvious that as simply a matter of scale, there are bands with far larger groups of fanboys. Iron Maiden is the obvious example that comes to mind...

I'm not defending bad songs under the cover of artistic integrity, but you came in here not willing to back up your opinions until you were called on it, and in the interim I merely suggested (and said it might not be the case) that perhaps you were one of the admittedly many people out there that do write off present day QR based on their shift in artistic direction.
I admit calling it actual rapping was a bit of a bad call, but it definitely has a really distasteful vibe to it that I can not stand. I could bother to respond to a lot of the rest of this but I'm really not in the mood. Bottom line, I hated this album, and it has nothing to do with predisposition. If Queensryche ever put out another album I like, I'll be the first person to say it. However, until then, we clearly must agree to disagree because we're clearly at opposite ends of the spectrum here. We're both entitled to our own opinions, so that's that.
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  #15  
Old 03-20-2009, 05:06 PM
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I admit calling it actual rapping was a bit of a bad call, but it definitely has a really distasteful vibe to it that I can not stand. I could bother to respond to a lot of the rest of this but I'm really not in the mood. Bottom line, I hated this album, and it has nothing to do with predisposition. If Queensryche ever put out another album I like, I'll be the first person to say it. However, until then, we clearly must agree to disagree because we're clearly at opposite ends of the spectrum here. We're both entitled to our own opinions, so that's that.
You're entitled to your opinion, and even your predispositions (and judging by your comments about "Sliver" even if you're not predispositioned to dislike QR releases, I do think you're predispositioned against non-traditional - in the rock/hard rock/metal sense - vocal elements.) At either rate, I was just trying to get at where you're coming from.
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  #16  
Old 03-20-2009, 05:08 PM
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I do think you're predispositioned against non-traditional - in the rock/hard rock/metal sense - vocal elements.
I am, and I have absolutely no shame in admitting this, even if it makes me a close-minded fool.
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  #17  
Old 03-20-2009, 05:10 PM
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I am, and I have absolutely no shame in admitting this, even if it makes me a close-minded fool.
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  #18  
Old 05-15-2009, 12:12 AM
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this album was incredibly boring
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